Advice on getting new gear

[Istvan]

Hi All,

New to this forum so first I would like to say hello.

I have been fishing since I can remember, but it was pretty much exclusively bass, perch, and pike from a boat with live bait back in Canada. Recently I have been doing rainbow trout fishing from shore (in Japan) with a cheapo Shimano setup I picked up at costco. It is totally fine for my needs so far, but am looking to move into ocean fishing predominantely from a pier or the shore down by Ito. I have zero ocean fishing experience and am looking for recommendations regarding what kit I should be looking at. If what I can pick up can also do double duty for trout fishing even better. As I have recently discovered I am the worlds worst fly fisherman (just started with a beginners set) I am looking to focus on spinning equipment (or at least a non fly setup).

The budget is open, and I would like to look at the high end as I see this as an investment in equipment that I will be able to use 20 years from now, but am also interested in the best price/performance range as well. If anyone here has any advice on setup I would be very glad to hear it.

Cheers,

Steve

[Maineman]

There is a lot of posts on this subject already. I suggest you use the advanced search and put in words like "reel", "reels", "rod", "rods". You will see lot's of info.

[Istvan]

Thanks Maineman,

That was the first thing I did actually and what led me to this forum. I guess there is too much information for me to narrow it down to my needs. I'll go ask at a shop.

Cheers,

Steve

[Maineman]

Hi Steve,
Yep, the amount of info can be a bit much to sift through. I'll give you a brief run down.
It's likely you will be focusing on shore fishing so targets will be seabass, flounder, flathead, small yellowtail, porgy, etc.. I will focus on gear for casting lures and plastics because I'm not much of a bait fisherman.
Reels: Shimano 2500, 3000, 4000 class. Top down by model, Stella, Twin Power, Biomaster, Ultegra. Daiwa 1500, 2000, 3000, 4000, Exist, Certate, Luvias, Seagate (heavy duty).
Rods: 8~10ft light action spinning Basically seabass rods. Some good makers; Palms, Smith, Daiko, Megabass, Graphite Leader, (Daiwa and Shimano high end models)
Line; PE .8~2 (1.2 is a good start) Flourocarbon leader 15~25lb
Your best bet is to check the used market at a Tackleberrys shop. They are all over, check their website for a store close to you. You will save about 50% or more off retail.
The smaller class reels can work for trout but you should get a trout rod as well.
Where are you located? If you are fairly close to Chigasaki you could stop by my place sometime and I can show you a variety of gear. You could also give me a call. Send me a private message through this site and I'll give you my number.

Good luck!
Cheers, maineman

[Istvan]

Thanks Maineman, that helps a lot.

I am in Machida during the week and down to Ito as many weekends as I can, so not too far from Chigasaki. Stuck in Tokyo this weekend as I am trying the JLPT.

That is exactly the kind of info I was looking for. I have a Tackleberry not far from here and I have checked out their online shop, but unless you know what you are looking for it is hard to navigate, again so many choices.

As Aji can be fished from shore down in Ito I will also be targeting them, but will assume they can be caught with the same gear.

Once I have investigated and decided on some gear, I'd definitely appreciate your insight before pulling the trigger on the gear.

Cheers,

Steve

[Maineman]

Steve,
If you get a chance take a detour over to Chigasaki sometime. I have most of the gear for lure fishing from shore so you can get an idea of what you need. There are 5 Tackleberrys within ~30 mins from my house. I'm home most weekdays and evenings. Weekends I go to Ito as well but it is for game fishing on a private boat, tuna, billfish, dorado, etc..
Tkbys is pretty well organized. They will have the sea bass shore casting rods in one section and reels, lures as well. There are a lot of clunkers but some real bargains on quality gear as well.
Give me a holler anytime,
Cheers, mm

[Istvan]

Thanks again Maineman,

I think I'll take you up on that one of these days, but today I made the mistake of going to a Tackleberry. I ended up picking up an 07 Stella 4000 and a Branzino 107 LML. I wanted to be prepared for the long weekend coming up, and with everything going on there would be no way I'd make it to your place before then.

Fishing on a private boat! Sounds like a great time. If you are down there some weekend evenings and not fishing or over-nighting on the boat give me a call and perhaps we can meet up there as well.

Thanks again for the advice.

Cheers,

Steve

[Istvan]

Maineman

I just tried to PM you but not sure if it went through. I initially got an error message and then it seemed to send but my outbox only shows a quoted message from here and not what I typed. I sent you my contact info, if you didn't get it, please drop me a line and I'll resend.

Cheers,

Steve

[Maineman]

Hi Steve,
Just got the quote, nothing else. Please try again or I will send you my contact info.

[Maineman]

Thanks again Maineman,

I think I'll take you up on that one of these days, but today I made the mistake of going to a Tackleberry. I ended up picking up an 07 Stella 4000 and a Branzino 107 LML. I wanted to be prepared for the long weekend coming up, and with everything going on there would be no way I'd make it to your place before then.

Fishing on a private boat! Sounds like a great time. If you are down there some weekend evenings and not fishing or over-nighting on the boat give me a call and perhaps we can meet up there as well.

Thanks again for the advice.

Cheers,

Steve

Hi Steve
I am a Tackleberrys addict so I know how it is to drop some cash in those shops. Stella 4000 is a great middle wt class reel. It is light enough to work for smaller game but strong enough for some bigger stuff. Can handle almost anything from shore. A bit big for area trout but will work. In any case a fine reel. I don't own any non-sw Stellas but I have the Twin Power MG's in most of the body classes. Not a lot difference but I can get a much newer TP for less money and the performance is very close, though nothing not to like about a Stella.
The Branzino is a good rod. It will work fine in a lot of shore applications. It's a bit long for quick action work but should cast a long distance and have a good feel to it. A good match to the Stella 4000. I have the Branzino Demon Hooker, 8'3" as well as the Nightmare Custom, 9'1.5". They are great rods with excellant sensitivity but they are not indestructable. Avoid high sticking or dead lifting with any good size fish. Whether or not you got a good deal depends on the condition and the price but Tkbys is pretty fair in most cases. If you have any worries about the reel you can take it to a major tackle shop like Joshuo and they will send it to the factory for service. About 5000 yen but they will make sure it is in good shape and replace minor parts if needed.
I was told by a local in Ito that you can catch baracuda from along the shore in the early morning, before and just at sunrise. Surface and shallow running lures with quick actions. Reel them fast, faster than you think you should. Not a bad idea to use thin wire leaders. The ones they sell for tachiou will work.
You got some good gear so get on the water and see what's biting!
Cheers, mm

[Istvan]

Maineman,

Thanks again for the tips. The rod I picked up was a Full Moon Custom. It just felt so good in my hands I couldn't resist, and it is in like new condition. The reel has a few scratches but seems sound mechanically, smooth and silent. The price was absolutely right, I can barely wait to try this combination out. I figure this will be dedicated to shore fishing, and I'll continue using the cheapo spinning set for trout, and perhaps take some fly casting lessons before I kill myself. I can always pick up a dedicated fresh water kit later.

Baracuda! That is awesome, I used fish for Pike so this should be fun. It will be very early morning this time of year to be in position at sunrise.

If you don't mind I have another question. I am wondering if my setup will allow me to catch Aji. They seem to be best fished on lighter softbaits. Do you know of any lures that Aji will go for that will be castable by my kit?

Cheers,

Steve

[Maineman]

That is a nice rod and well suited for shore game especially seabass, small yellowtail and flounder. Keep your lures in the middle range if possible. Avoid going over the max. Those rods have such a thin taper at the tip it is risky to try and cast heavy lures. Also when landing fish on the beach or jetties it is easy to get into a high stick situation especially with a long rod like that. Avoid it at all times, best to just back-up and drag the fish onto the shore keeping the rod tip out in front of you. Don't try to lift any heavy fish from piers or high jetties. Get a good telescoping landing net 4.5~6 mts.
I don't target aji much except when catching them to use as live bait. Then I use a typical aji bait rig, sinker on the bottom with 3 or 4 small hooks baited with shrimp. Aji are pretty skittish and don't take lures well but they will on occasion. Use the same small minnows and jigs used for rockfish and mebaru. Just after sundown is a good time to catch them. They like areas with lights shining in the water. Middle tides and partial moon phases are good. Your trout outfit might make for a better aji kit but don't know if the reel will take the salt.

[Istvan]

I picked up a good daiwa telescoping net, I think 6.0 meters or so as I figured if I am fishing from a pier there is no way I will get away with lifting the fish. I will mind your advice regarding landing the fish. I know I will have a tendency to put my pole high during the fight and throughout end game. I picked up a couple vibes in the 15 to 20 gram range and fit the reel with PE 1.0 line.

There is no way my trout kit will handle the salt, so maybe I need to upgrade my trout kit . I'm thinking a salt water Stella in the 1000 range and a new pole that can do double duty for aji (my wife loves aji), what a great excuse!

[Maineman]

Sounds like you are getting geared-up pretty well.
As for trout in Japan I am pretty much fly fishing only. I'm not a great fly fisherman but I much prefer the fly game over spinning. If you picked up the typical "Starter kit" that is likely your problem. Ironically thoses kits usually have such crap rods and lines that even an expert would have trouble casting them. Lucky for you there is Tkbys! The shop in Fujisawa center and the one in Odawara both have a good selection of fly rods. You want a slow action graphite like an older Orvis or the Shimano Freestones, they practically cast themselves. Next you want to get the best line you can afford. A decent line is going to run 7~10k yen but it is a good investment. Weight forward lines are a good all round choice and the easiest to cast. If you are doing light work with dry flys then a dual taper is better suited. A good wt rod to start with is a #6. A 4# or 5# will be OK but avoid going lighter then 4# or heavier then a 6#. Reel doesn't really mater much for starting out but it should have a decent balance with the rod.
A couple of my favorite area places are Forest Springs in Hadano and River Spot on the Hayato river in Tanzawa. Both have decent fish and good numbers of big fish in the 4~5 lb range and some up to 8 or 10lbs.

[Aki]

Good advice there mainman. Sounds like you guys are ready to catch some fish now.
Here's my advice on where to fish now. Good number of seabass are in the Saru Shima (monky island) area as of now. Best shore fishing spot will be the north end of the island (rocky shore). It is a bit of walk (stairs), but well worth it. Most fish are in 40~60cm range but bigger fish are in the mix. Out going tide is the key. Range vibe 90ES have been working great, but you may see some surface action as well.

[Istvan]

Thanks maineman.

I did get a Tiemco starters kit. I figured they'd be aimed at simplicity as opposed to performance. I spend more time untangling, pulling flies out of my skin, and tying new flies on that shouldn't have been lost in the first place than I do fishing. I know I am using too much strength, but I can't seem to get my rod to flex properly without power. The only cast I can do successfully is a roll cast. I think I'll take your advice and try a new rod, but an affordable one incase it turns out I just suck at it.

I have another question for you. Regarding the shock leader, how many feet should I be using with my setup...5?

Hi Aki,

Thanks for the tip! Hopefully I can find the time to try those spots!

Cheers,

Steve

[Istvan]

Maineman,

I took your advice regarding a fly rod and picked up a six weight Shimano Freestone from, you guessed it, tackle berry's. It is an FV 906. I have since seen that the FV freestones aren't as high quality as the regular ones, but it already makes my old rod feel like a baseball bat. I may be able to actually fly fish now without destroying everything in my path. Will be trying it and the other gear out this weekend.

Thanks,

Steve

[Maineman]

Hi Steve,
It isn't so much that the Freestones are not a quality rod. They have a slower blank which is cheaper to manufacture then the high carbon fast blanks. Fast rods are more popular but only among experienced casters. For a beginner a slow rod is much easier to handle. I have a 3# Freestone which is one of my favorite rods to cast and it has a lot of competition with some much more expensive rods. A longer rod is also better to start with so the 9' is a good length. I will emphasize again that a good quality line is important. The difference between low and high quality line is even more pronounced then the quality of the rod. If the line you have is a dual taper I would suggest investing in a high quality Weight Forward floating line. When starting out casting go slower then you think you should and add speed and power gradually until you get good results. The rod is going to have a range where it is properly loaded and will cast well. It is determined by the amount of line you have in the air. Typically it is about 30 feet but will vary depending on the rod and the line. It is a good idea to find that range and then maybe mark the line with ink or a piece of tape right above the reel. That way if you are having trouble you can get back to a good starting point. A good rule of thumb, if you are having trouble casting, slow down, the tendency for most people is to add power and speed which usually makes things worse.
Good luck and let me know how you do.
Cheers, mm

[Istvan]

Hi Maineman,

Sorry, my meaning was that the FV versions of the Freestones are supposedly the "budget versions" of the Freestone line. I have so far only dry cast with the old line, but can already feel a huge difference. I will invest in new line before I try it out. As I want to do some dry fly fishing as well, can I do that with the weight forward line. If I can then I will go for the weight forward line for now until I learn how to cast it consistently even if it isn't ideal for dry flies.

Thanks for the casting tips!

Cheers,

Steve

[Maineman]

Steve,

You can cast drys with a WF line well enough. Unless you are trying for really spooky trout in calm waters then there isn't much difference anyway. Because you will be able to cast the WF easier it is the better choise. You may want to go a little lighter and longer on your leader if you are doing mostly drys. A 9' 6X nylon leader would be good and then tie on an additional 2'~3' of 6x nylon tippet. If you are going to cast mostly streamers and wet flys I would suggest moving to a 7' 4x fluorocarbon leader and tippet.

Cheers, mm